Country suggestions

[stubsound]

Got a gig replacing drums and laying down real bass, guitars and keys on a straight country song. Which kit would you suggest as a good starting point? See my signature to see what I got.
 
Thanks.

Stig-R. Eliassen

Master - PT 7.4.2 HD3 Accel/ G5 Dual 2.3/ 6.5 Gb RAM/ OS 10.5.8
Slave - VE Pro 5/ 6-core Westmere/ 24 Gb RAM/ OS 10.6.8/ Superior 2.3.2, dfh Superior, C&V SDX, NY vol. 2 SDX, Roots Bundle SDX, Twisted kit, Drumtracker/ TD-15K

Topic

[Scott]

Uptempo straight country or ballad straight country? Initially I would lean towards C&V using sticks or brushes. I would also try the ‘rods’ stick tool as an option. Although the Avatar kit also has sticks, brushes, and rods, and may sound better in the mix. Hard to say without hearing the tune.

Don’t forget that if it’s modern country, all bets are off. Just about any drum sound can be used.

Scott Sibley - Toontrack
Technical Advisor

[stubsound]

Thanks, Scott. It’s uptempo with a BPM of 153. Kick on 1 and 3, snare on 2 and 4. You know the kind.
 
I’m leaning towards Avatar for this song. It sounds awesome in the mix, but I’ll know more once I’ve replaced the horrible MIDI bass. I’m thinking of using brushes in the verses, and sticks in the choruses. Is this “normal”? I’m not very familiar with this genre.

Stig-R. Eliassen

Master - PT 7.4.2 HD3 Accel/ G5 Dual 2.3/ 6.5 Gb RAM/ OS 10.5.8
Slave - VE Pro 5/ 6-core Westmere/ 24 Gb RAM/ OS 10.6.8/ Superior 2.3.2, dfh Superior, C&V SDX, NY vol. 2 SDX, Roots Bundle SDX, Twisted kit, Drumtracker/ TD-15K

[Scott]

I’m thinking of using brushes in the verses, and sticks in the choruses. Is this “normal”?

It’s not customary to switch between sticks/brushes/rods in the same song.

Of course, if it can be done, do it! What I mean is; if there is a pause between the verse and the chorus and a real drummer could switch then do it.

Stylistically, if I were doing something where I wanted to switch between brushes and sticks, I would make sure the kits sound really different. Maybe mono the verses with brushes and filter it for a lo-fi sound and then ‘open it up’ in the chorus with the sticks. There’s lots of ways to skin a cat.

Scott Sibley - Toontrack
Technical Advisor

[stubsound]

Thanks again, Scott. Yeah, I want to keep it real and make it sound like a live band played it. That’s why I get these gigs in the first place. There is a pause between the 2nd verse and the 1st chorus, so it can be done. I could use brushes from intro through 2nd verse, and sticks for the rest of the song. Just have to experiment a little.
 

Stylistically, if I were doing something where I wanted to switch between brushes and sticks, I would make sure the kits sound really different. Maybe mono the verses with brushes and filter it for a lo-fi sound and then ‘open it up’ in the chorus with the sticks. There’s lots of ways to skin a cat.

I’m pretty sure that my clients would prefer a natural drum sound on this song, but to mono the kit could be cool. Thanks for your insight on this.
 

Stig-R. Eliassen

Master - PT 7.4.2 HD3 Accel/ G5 Dual 2.3/ 6.5 Gb RAM/ OS 10.5.8
Slave - VE Pro 5/ 6-core Westmere/ 24 Gb RAM/ OS 10.6.8/ Superior 2.3.2, dfh Superior, C&V SDX, NY vol. 2 SDX, Roots Bundle SDX, Twisted kit, Drumtracker/ TD-15K

[Scott]

I could use brushes from intro through 2nd verse, and sticks for the rest of the song.

Give the ‘rods’ a try also. Maybe through the whole song. If you’re not familiar with them, they are thin rods (think shish kabob skewers) bundled together. They sound somewhere between brushes and sticks. They could work too. 

Scott Sibley - Toontrack
Technical Advisor

[stubsound]

Give the ‘rods’ a try also. Maybe through the whole song. If you’re not familiar with them, they are thin rods (think shish kabob skewers) bundled together. They sound somewhere between brushes and sticks. They could work too.

Ah yes, the spaghetti bundle. I haven’t even tried those. Cool. That could actually be even better. Thanks.

Stig-R. Eliassen

Master - PT 7.4.2 HD3 Accel/ G5 Dual 2.3/ 6.5 Gb RAM/ OS 10.5.8
Slave - VE Pro 5/ 6-core Westmere/ 24 Gb RAM/ OS 10.6.8/ Superior 2.3.2, dfh Superior, C&V SDX, NY vol. 2 SDX, Roots Bundle SDX, Twisted kit, Drumtracker/ TD-15K

[Juicy]

Once that real bass is pumping it will make a nice quality lift.
Find a sound/kit that works great with the chorus first and in the verse try just using real dynamics to pull the listener “in”.
A second snare set up like some “real” drummers use,may be cool,this would give you a stronger or subtle change needed but the kit would still lock it together.
For instance the 2nd snare may be just the same as the first but undampened and the first may just be dampened(SHORTER).
It may be just Dryer verse an roomier chorus for the same kit.Rods might be worthy of a try,if you use brushes just keep em all the way.

[stubsound]

Once that real bass is pumping it will make a nice quality lift.
Find a sound/kit that works great with the chorus first and in the verse try just using real dynamics to pull the listener “in”.
A second snare set up like some “real” drummers use,may be cool,this would give you a stronger or subtle change needed but the kit would still lock it together.
For instance the 2nd snare may be just the same as the first but undampened and the first may just be dampened(SHORTER).
It may be just Dryer verse an roomier chorus for the same kit.Rods might be worthy of a try,if you use brushes just keep em all the way.

Yes, a second snare is also a good idea. A snare that opens up in the chorus. Good advice. I usually ride the send faders feeding the FX busses a few passes during mixing, and more often than not I mix the chorus a little more roomy. A nice trick that also works well on snares.

Thanks for sharing your ideas.

Stig-R. Eliassen

Master - PT 7.4.2 HD3 Accel/ G5 Dual 2.3/ 6.5 Gb RAM/ OS 10.5.8
Slave - VE Pro 5/ 6-core Westmere/ 24 Gb RAM/ OS 10.6.8/ Superior 2.3.2, dfh Superior, C&V SDX, NY vol. 2 SDX, Roots Bundle SDX, Twisted kit, Drumtracker/ TD-15K

[oceantracks]

Scott you can hear many examples of this, going from brushes to sticks, including one on your own website up here demonstrating the new Music City Expansion Pack….check out the “Chico” example..

TH

Logic 9.1.4
PT9
Mac Pro Dual 2.8, 8G RAM
All Internal SATA drives
OSX 10.6.7
Apogee Duet 2

[Juicy]

Sorry to chime in here but that is a perfect example of brushes and sticks working very well.

10,20 years ago your top session studio guy wouldnt really want to do it but these days anything goes and in this case works well.What another really nice demo that is.

[Author]

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