Brian BoydHi All – this is the weirdest – I recorded 3 instrument tracks in Pro Tools – kick, snare, hihats. All good until I save and playback. The kick sound happens a second before the note on the timeline. It’s not delay compensation, sample rate, etc. The snare and hit are perfectly synced, but the kick is a second early (even though the visual notes are perfectly aligned). Any thoughts? Thanks!
drumjack52Why 3 instrument tracks? There’s no need to do that. I use multi-out in SD3 (which is on an instrument tracks) to separate aux tracks in PT 2021.6. This allows me to hear the kit pieces without having to record enable the tracks if they were audio tracks. When I’m satisfied with the sound I then send them to separate audio tracks. All this business is taken care of with a track preset in PT that sets up everything I need to do drums with SD3 so with one click I get the entire 20 some tracks in PT. What’s your routing in both SD3 and PT? Do you have any routings to unused sends or tracks? Do you have SD3 load everything into ram or are you streaming from your samples drive? Please tell me you don’t have the samples on your system drive.
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.0
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
Brian BoydThanks for replying.
Yes, 3 instrument tracks: 1 for kick, 1 for snare, 1 for hihats. That’s all I want/need in this session.
So, here’s what happens: In Pro Tools (tried in both 2025 and 2024) I record the kick (to a click track) on my midi keyboard. Then the snare, then the hihats. On playback, they are all in sync. I save the session. Then on playback after saving, the kick is out of sync, it plays a second before the visual midi note. This only happens with the kick. If I record any other SD3 drum, it stays in time. And it’s only in this particular session. Weird, yes?
And of course the samples aren’t on my system. They are on a 4TB SDD.
BB
drumjack52When you save the session are the tracks still MIDI or have you rendered them to audio? Do you record the snare and hats using the click track like you do the kick? What’s your audio buffer setting? I have never seen what you’re describing even on a relatively low-powered system like in my sig file. Try this: manually enter using PT’s MIDI editor a string of notes for the kick – something like 4 notes per measure at whatever tempo you like. Then do a second line for snare and a third line for the hats. Then hit play and see what happens. Do this first with everything MIDI and if that’s okay then render the MIDI to audio and try again. If this passes then the problem is not specifically with SD3. What I’m trying to do here is take the human (you) out of the loop and give SD3 the best possible input.
Are you using any effects in SD3? Multi-out or 2 channel stereo? What SDX? Do you have the problem with every kick drum in the library?
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.0
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
Brian BoydWhen you save the session are the tracks still MIDI or have you rendered them to audio?
YES.
Do you record the snare and hats using the click track like you do the kick?
YES.
What’s your audio buffer setting? Usually 256, but been advised to reduce to 64 when tracking.
I have never seen what you’re describing even on a relatively low-powered system like in my sig file.
Me neither! I’m using a Mac Mini M4 Pro (64GB unified memory, 1TB SSD), and UAD Apollo 8 DAW. All sessions etc. are on external Samsung SSDs.
Try this: manually enter using PT’s MIDI editor a string of notes for the kick – something like 4 notes per measure at whatever tempo you like. Then do a second line for snare and a third line for the hats. Then hit play and see what happens. Do this first with everything MIDI and if that’s okay then render the MIDI to audio and try again. If this passes then the problem is not specifically with SD3. What I’m trying to do here is take the human (you) out of the loop and give SD3 the best possible input.
Will do, I’ll report back. Thanks.
Are you using any effects in SD3? Multi-out or 2 channel stereo? What SDX? Do you have the problem with every kick drum in the library?
No effects, 2 channel stereo. No SDX. And I’ll check the other kicks…
cheers,
BB.
Brian BoydSo….as you suggested, I recorded the kick track in Midi Editor rather than on midi keyboard, and all seems good. But when I try to record with the keyboard, the issue continues, so I guess there is a sink issue with my keyboard…more research needed.
Many thanks for your very helpful suggestion…Now I just have to “humanize” the midi kick track as it’s aligned to the grid!
cheers,
BB
Brian BoydBut puzzlingly, the Superior Drummer 3 gui shows the drum impact earlier than the sound, even now that it’s recorded in the midi editor….
drumjack52So….as you suggested, I recorded the kick track in Midi Editor rather than on midi keyboard, and all seems good. But when I try to record with the keyboard, the issue continues, so I guess there is a sink issue with my keyboard…more research needed.
Many thanks for your very helpful suggestion…Now I just have to “humanize” the midi kick track as it’s aligned to the grid!
cheers,
BB
We all know there is audio latency depending on the amount of buffers, etc. What is less known is MIDI latency and there’s no real way to fix that. That latter might be part of the issue. Glad to hear that the method I outlined is working for you. Like I said I’m just trying to remove any possible variables and get back to basics. If you had still had the problem using my method then yeah – gremlins do abound. Your MIDI keyboard – synth action or hammer action (like a piano would have)?
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.0
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
Mark KingDo you use the same keyboard to record the midi for bass, snare and hi hats? If you do then that can’t be it. Do you hear the delay when you monitor while recording the midi? If not then again it’s something else. I don’t use pro tools but are you sure you haven’t got anything different on the kick track?
SD3 with older sdx,s plus Rooms of Hansa and Death & Darkness. Cubase and wavelab current versions. Roland TD50x using all trigger inputs for triggering SD3 only. Windows 11 computer. Various keyboards and outboard gear as well as VST instruments. Acoustic drums: Yamaha 9000 natural wood and Pearl masters. Various snare drums. RME BabyFace Pro FS and Adam A7X monitors
drumjack52Hammer action, yes (M-Audio Keystation88 Mk3).
There’s your problem. Hammer action will NEVER give you perfect timing for drum work. I’ve played both types of keyboards so it’s a been there/done that deal. And don’t get me started on the quality (or lack thereof) of the Keystation keyboards. If you’re at all serious about using a keyboard for drums get a synth action one.
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.0
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
drumjack52Do you use the same keyboard to record the midi for bass, snare and hi hats? If you do then that can’t be it. Do you hear the delay when you monitor while recording the midi? If not then again it’s something else. I don’t use pro tools but are you sure you haven’t got anything different on the kick track?
Mark: Read my reply. That the op was able to manually enter notes and the problem went away kind of puts a nail in the coffin if you will.
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.0
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
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