Problems with 'use browser midi'

[Robert Shaplo]

I’m having a problem using ‘use browser midi’ along with either ‘change octave’ and/or ‘inversion’.

In an attempt to ‘even out’ a progression I try to either raise or lower the chords to keep them within a similar octave range.

What I find is after I’ve raised/lowered all chords accordingly (octave/inversion) and then use the ‘use browser midi’  function the chords I’ve altered return to their original state.  In the photos you can see the Em was lowered and the Dm was raised (EZ 1)  however after using the ‘use browser midi’  function (EZ 2) they both returned the previous state before I raised/lowered them.

How can one raise and or lower their chords and then use the ‘use browser midi’ and keep them at the chosen octave and/or inversion ?

Thank you…

 

EZKeys 1.2.5

Windows 10 64bit

 

EZkeys version: 1.2.5
Operating system: Windows 10

Topic

[Henrik Ekblom]

These controls are affecting the MIDI that’s currently on track, and won’t be applied to the next MIDI you drag to the track.

This is because when you alter MIDI by lowering octaves, setting velocity, or changing inversion, it’s often made to fit the current MIDI you have on track. However, it may be a good idea to be able to keep these settings, and I’ll write it up as a feature request!

Henrik Ekblom - User Experience Designer
Toontrack

[Robert Shaplo]

Henrik Ekblom wrote:

These controls are affecting the MIDI that’s currently on track, and won’t be applied to the next MIDI you drag to the track.

 

Not clear what you meant by ‘won’t be applied to the next MIDI you drag to the track’.

The four chords you saw were all present when I activated ‘use browser midi’ , nothing was added or dragged  to the track after the fact. So they were all ‘currently on track’ as you said when I applied use browser midi.

This even happens with just one chord.  I dropped the octave of the C (below) then applied ‘use browser midi’ which then returned the chord back to the original octave it was in.  So it’s not a matter of keeping settings for additional chords added after the fact. It happens to all current and added chords as well.  TY

 

[Henrik Ekblom]

When you change inversion or octave on a song block, you change the MIDI notes in it. If you use Use Browser MIDI to add other MIDI to the current chords, the changed inversion and octave isn’t kept.

E.g., those properties aren’t stored in the chord, they are stored in the MIDI, and when the MIDI is changed the properties are reset.

But as I said, sometimes you might want to keep those settings, and I have written down this as a feature request!

Henrik Ekblom - User Experience Designer
Toontrack

[Robert Shaplo]

Henrik Ekblom wrote:

If you use Use Browser MIDI to add other MIDI to the current chords, the changed inversion and octave isn’t kept.

I don’t see the point of having inversion and/or octave if the software throws out any changes you have made then there after.  However since you have added ‘keeping user changes made’ as a feature request I suppose it’s a moot point.

I believe an EZKeys 2 is long overdue, I do hope Toontrack feels the same.   Thank you for your help.

 

 

[joe]

The Toontrack MIDI pattern has a certain flow.
And amongst other things that flow depends on a certain structure and relation of the octaves which the several chords are laying in.

When we force an octave jump that doesn’t match with the original flow of the MIDI data, then the chord transitions have to be played differently.

I don’t think that some kind of an automation would be helpful.
After applying the Toontrack MIDI pattern we can easily adjust every single chord.

So I would expect automation to be more of a problem rather than a positive extension.
I am of the opinion that subsequent adjustment is the better way to go.

So if you really want to update EZkeys, please make sure this new feature is only optional!

License transfer fees countervalue is $ 2,250.00
(done...)

So my anger about the Toontrack license transfer fee introduced in June 2021 is not entirely unfounded...

https://www.toontrack.com/faq/transfer-of-license-and-multiple-installs-important-information/

[John]

I agree with Joe’s observations regarding the need to watch the flow and the chord structure – I like the wording in your phrase  “..in which several chords are laying in”.  This is how I think of it as well.  There is a challenge, when taking the basic sequence that most closely fits the “style” that your composition needs – you want to keep the flow of the changes being made to conform it into your own unique melody line, while trying to “fit” those changes in with the existing chord structure.  At times, you feel you have to go “outside” or above or below, the given structure and it can get difficult then, to make that change sound “natural”.

Sometimes I’ve had better results at this by splitting the problem area, removing a particular “problematic” chord, and locating another one I can copy/paste in, that HAS a better-matching chord (i.e. note arrangement) and corresponding note progression – then when I make my chord change it doesn’t often have to require an octave change or a change far enough “out” that it doesn’t sound natural in the progression.  I may not be expressing this very well because I’m also still a very new EZKeys user, but it seems to me that these kinds of steps are the real “meat -n- potatoes” of why this app is so very cool. It’s the ability to let you begin with a great-sounding sample but then alter it to your own unique melody needs.

And I also share the concern Joe stated (so I want to add my own vote as well) – if you try to automate this kind of thing, it *could* result in a ver 2 that some of us would view as a negative factor in the creative flow – so if that’s something being looked into, at least make it a user-toggle feature that we can use or not use, as an option.  I’d hate to lose the kind of functionality that this version has in some of what I feel are the most creative aspects of the app.

I’ve tried to think of particular areas within EZKeys that I’d love to recommend for a ver 2 –  and it’s tough.   The ONLY thing I’d love on my wish-list for an EZKeys2,  is a built-in MIDI editor because when I get to the note-level need to make changes, then I must import the phrase into my DAW to tweak it at that MIDI note level.   Otherwise,  I am content to work right in stand-alone mode all day long composing an entire song piano track, only opening the DAW when it’s time to drag the track into a song project, to add other tracks, FX, and do the mix.  EZKeys is a  great app, much more than a great plug-in, it’s a really powerful stand-alone creative composing tool. And while it may be only a version 1.x.x, it’s got incredible features and functionality.

John D.

EZkeys version: 1.2.5
Operating system: Windows 10

using both CW Sonar and Studio One 4 DAW; Win 10 OS; commercial audio loops as well as MIDI, EZDrummer and EZKeys; Presonus Studio 2/6 I/F; Nectar2 Production Ste; iZotope Ozone for mastering.

[Robert Shaplo]

Chord inversions are an integral part of song composition, why anyone would argue against their use is hard to understand. As it stands now, EZKeys does not properly handle user selected chord inversions, and as such I simply requested it be corrected.

That said, if you don’t like this feature, then simply don’t use it.

[Author]

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