Hi!
How should I mix down individual tracks from the my song in midi format inside the Superior Drummer VSTi to audio so I reduce RAM usage and can finetune everything later?
I would like to have one audio track for the kickdrum(s), one for snare, one for toms, one for crashes, one for hihat, one for other cymbals…should I click the “drums” view of SD and solo the kitpiece, e.g. the snare or all toms, then export my song/bounce it so get the first track? Then repeat for all other kitpieces… OR should I leave the “drums” view untouched, but go to “mixer” and solo the channels there?
The problem is that I would normally go for the first approach with kitpieces, BUT there is bleed and there are ambience channels…I don’t know if soloing the e.g. snare will automatically get the individual bleed and ambience signals as well, from all channels with the snare… or if my kitpiece approach will lead to losing the broad sound because bleed and ambience are lost?
What do you recommend? Mixing the song with one kitpiece per track is easier…I can e.g. raise certain parts or lower the volume per track and not having the complete drums in the playback.
SeelenPuls ~ Poetic metal from Austria: SeelenPuls.at
Grummelgnom ~ Sociocritical metal from the forest: Grummelgnom.at
Hi!
How should I mix down individual tracks from the my song in midi format inside the Superior Drummer VSTi to audio so I reduce RAM usage and can finetune everything later?
I would like to have one audio track for the kickdrum(s), one for snare, one for toms, one for crashes, one for hihat, one for other cymbals…should I click the “drums” view of SD and solo the kitpiece, e.g. the snare or all toms, then export my song/bounce it so get the first track? Then repeat for all other kitpieces… OR should I leave the “drums” view untouched, but go to “mixer” and solo the channels there?
The problem is that I would normally go for the first approach with kitpieces, BUT there is bleed and there are ambience channels…I don’t know if soloing the e.g. snare will automatically get the individual bleed and ambience signals as well, from all channels with the snare… or if my kitpiece approach will lead to losing the broad sound because bleed and ambience are lost?
What do you recommend? Mixing the song with one kitpiece per track is easier…I can e.g. raise certain parts or lower the volume per track and not having the complete drums in the playback.
SeelenPuls ~ Poetic metal from Austria: SeelenPuls.at
Grummelgnom ~ Sociocritical metal from the forest: Grummelgnom.at
Thanks, but multiout does not solve my problem…I want to bounce all VSTis before mixing…I cannot have EZ Bass, Superior Drummer and a ton of orchestral libraries all active in the RAM.
Moreover, multiout does not let me manually increase the volume of the e.g. hihat at 2 minute 2 seconds to 2 minute 8 seconds…I can do that with audio files and volume envelopes.
Multiout DOES allow you to manually adjust the volume of say a hihat (that’s the purpose of using multiout). I do it all the time – you need to learn how to do level automation adjustments in your daw. Multiout uses no more ram than doing things your way. You absolutely have to learn proper mixing and recording. Take a look at the Groove 3 website for plenty of mixing and recording courses.
How much ram do you have in your computer? With 48 gig of ram I have yet to run into a problem with 40+ tracks of SD3 outputs (have you seen the mixer shot I posted earlier?) and various sample based instruments. Without rendering anything to audio. I only render to audio when I’m happy with the sound of something. Modern Macs are insanely speedy on swapping out memory usage amongst programs. The only time my system chokes is on cpu power not memory usage. And I run an ancient 2012 MacPro desktop with a hex core 3.46GHz cpu – hardly state of the art.
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.1
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
Thanks!
My computer:
Mainboard: MSI MAG B550 Tomahawk
Processor: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X, 8x 3.60GHz
RAM: Kingston Fury 64GB DDR4-3200
My SD3 preset is 3,400 MB. Then I have EZ Bass, VSL Piano, VSL Violin, Cello, Choir, strings, brass, BestService Engine with medieval instruments etc. etc.
The main problem is not the multiout, but that I also want to send the audio files to a professional mixer…so I need to know what to export and how. With mixer, I don’t mean an
external mixer in my DAW, but a professional studio that offers mixing. 🙂
But it seems that I only have to export the orange buses in my SD mixer…one by one…by soloing one bus, exporting it, then soloing the next one etc.
SeelenPuls ~ Poetic metal from Austria: SeelenPuls.at
Grummelgnom ~ Sociocritical metal from the forest: Grummelgnom.at
Thanks!
My computer:
Mainboard: MSI MAG B550 Tomahawk
Processor: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X, 8x 3.60GHz
RAM: Kingston Fury 64GB DDR4-3200My SD3 preset is 3,400 MB. Then I have EZ Bass, VSL Piano, VSL Violin, Cello, Choir, strings, brass, BestService Engine with medieval instruments etc. etc.
The main problem is not the multiout, but that I also want to send the audio files to a professional mixer…so I need to know what to export and how. With mixer, I don’t mean an
external mixer in my DAW, but a professional studio that offers mixing. 🙂But it seems that I only have to export the orange buses in my SD mixer…one by one…by soloing one bus, exporting it, then soloing the next one etc.
- This post was modified 7 months, 3 weeks ago by LeanderL.
NO NO NO! With multiout you can send the files to a mixer. You just need to properly route the outputs from SD3 to separate tracks in your daw. Multiout does NOT use more memory than what you’re doing. YOu’ve seen a partial screenshot of my mixer – each of those SD3 output groups go to a separate audio track in ProTools. So I end up with an audio track with the kick drum, another for the snare, yet another for hihat, rack toms to a track, etc. That way I can mix things just like a regular mix engineer would. No mucking about with soling individual tracks in SD3 and so forth.
Take a look at the Groove 3 site for tutorials on mixing – I think they have some free ones but their pay-for stuff is excellent.
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.1
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
Thanks!
Yes, I can also export tracks for the kick bus, snare, toms, HH, OH, Amb, Reverb and Comp without multioutput.
Anyway, I watched a tutorial how to do multioutput in Cakewalk. I have some outputs now…and created tracks for such channels. My drumkit only had out1&2…with some FX sitting there that are added to ALL sound…now that I have multiout, is there a way to add the FX to the entire drumkit instead of adding them to all channels again and again?
Question 2: my snare is too loud. +3 DB…I had increased the kitpiece by 2.0 because the snare was not loud enough. Should I set it to 0? But then I have to reduce the volume for all other kit pieces.
Out 1+2, 3+4 etc. all have the same FX…theoretically, I could remove them and add similar FX to the drum bus in the DAW….but I only have access to audio FX there and NOT SD3’s effects within SD3…so I can only use similar effects, but not the exact SD3 FX of my presets.
PS Does the hihat sound alike in both examples?
SeelenPuls ~ Poetic metal from Austria: SeelenPuls.at
Grummelgnom ~ Sociocritical metal from the forest: Grummelgnom.at
LeanderL: This is rapidly becoming not an SD3 issue but learning mixing procedures. Did you even look at the Groove 3 site? There’s no need to export anything from SD3 but properly use multiout in SD3 in conjunction with your daw. As to effects – you can still use SD3’s effects on tracks while still in the mixer if they give you what you want but if you’re sending stuff to a mixer then I’d hold off on using any SD3 specific effects. I prefer to have the tracks come out of SD3 in a raw state and do all my effects and mixing in my daw. That way I have ultimate flexibility in the sound.
Of course you could always leave SD3 live feeding you daw from multiout and use SD3’s built-in effects. You have 64 gig of ram so don’t be shy to use it. I have 48 gig of ram and the SD3 kit I use from Death and Darkness totals out at almost 14 gig when all loaded into ram and as I said before I never choke on ram usage but cpu load. And this is on sessions that have upwards of 40+ tracks in ProTools with a mix of sample-based vi’s and non-sample-based vi’s.
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.1
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
Thanks!
Could you please listen to “PS Does the hihat sound alike in both examples?
“?
The playback from SD3 vs. multiout and channels does not seem to sound alike. I want to know if it is a bug or what I am missing.
SeelenPuls ~ Poetic metal from Austria: SeelenPuls.at
Grummelgnom ~ Sociocritical metal from the forest: Grummelgnom.at
Thanks!
Could you please listen to “PS Does the hihat sound alike in both examples?
“?
The playback from SD3 vs. multiout and channels does not seem to sound alike. I want to know if it is a bug or what I am missing.
- This post was modified 7 months, 3 weeks ago by LeanderL.
There’s precious little difference between the two examples. Just use multiout and be done with it. That’s the only way to go with drums if you want to mix outside of SD3’s mixer. Not sure but I think what you’re doing with soloing an SD3 kitpiece loses the bleed from the other pieces.
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.1
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
Thanks! I did not solo kit pieces. I played the entire mid in SD3 and using ONE output channel vs. multiout. The hihat is an xdrum instrument.
Now I deleted every second kick and snare hit from the blast beat…now the hihat seems to sound the same.
SeelenPuls ~ Poetic metal from Austria: SeelenPuls.at
Grummelgnom ~ Sociocritical metal from the forest: Grummelgnom.at
Thanks! I did not solo kit pieces. I played the entire mid in SD3 and using ONE output channel vs. multiout. The hihat is an xdrum instrument.
Now I deleted every second kick and snare hit from the blast beat…now the hihat seems to sound the same.
- This post was modified 7 months, 3 weeks ago by LeanderL.
Why are you using an xdrum for a hihat? There’s no need for that. xdrums have a totally different mic setup – wish you had told us this when you started this thread. Xdrums (as near as I know) don’t have bleed on them – at least there’s nothing showing in the SD3 mixer. Use multiout and the regular hihat.
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.1
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
Hi Jack, Just an FYI – I use xdrums a lot and as an example I have a second (continually closed) hi hat on my kit. If I copy an existing Hi-Hat it will actually copy all the mic channels (bleeds) for that original instrument. Example on screenshot (All bleeds available – but I only use the close mic and OH for this one). Same for any other xdrums. I often duplicate toms and change parameters to give me a 6 tom set up regardless of library.
I do have a couple of “sampled” user cymbal instruments (chimes) that I use and they only have one channel as xdrums. I route these to a bus that then routes to my “cyms” bus channel and also has a send to my OH bus so my way of getting these one mic channel instruments into both a “cyms” bus and also into OH bus to give a bit more mixing flexibility. I like to have all instruments in my OH channel. Hope this is of use to you. cheers, Andrew
Dell Precision 7730, i7 6 Core 2.6 GHz, 128GB RAM, 1TB SSD and 3 x 2TB SSD, Windows 11, Cubase Pro 14, SD3 plus a variety of SDX's and EZX's, Orchestral Percussion, EZBASS, RME BabyFace Pro FS and KRK V4 monitors. Modified Yamaha DTX900, DTXPRESS4 and Edrumin10 triggering SD3. Yamaha pads/cymbals and Roland VH-10 HiHat. PDP Maple acoustic kit for live playing.
Hi Jack, Just an FYI – I use xdrums a lot and as an example I have a second (continually closed) hi hat on my kit. If I copy an existing Hi-Hat it will actually copy all the mic channels (bleeds) for that original instrument. Example on screenshot (All bleeds available – but I only use the close mic and OH for this one). Same for any other xdrums. I often duplicate toms and change parameters to give me a 6 tom set up regardless of library.
I do have a couple of “sampled” user cymbal instruments (chimes) that I use and they only have one channel as xdrums. I route these to a bus that then routes to my “cyms” bus channel and also has a send to my OH bus so my way of getting these one mic channel instruments into both a “cyms” bus and also into OH bus to give a bit more mixing flexibility. I like to have all instruments in my OH channel. Hope this is of use to you. cheers, Andrew
Operating system: Windows 10
Thanks for this. Do you see a bleed control for that second hihat in the mixer? I don’t when I look at my mixer for what for me is a fourth rack tom as an xdrum (I do a lot of Neil Peart type stuff that needs 4 rack toms). That’s what I based my comment on about bleed and xdrums. Am I missing something here?
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.1
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
Thanks! I did not solo kit pieces. I played the entire mid in SD3 and using ONE output channel vs. multiout. The hihat is an xdrum instrument.
Now I deleted every second kick and snare hit from the blast beat…now the hihat seems to sound the same.
- This post was modified 7 months, 3 weeks ago by LeanderL.
Why are you using an xdrum for a hihat? There’s no need for that. xdrums have a totally different mic setup – wish you had told us this when you started this thread. Xdrums (as near as I know) don’t have bleed on them – at least there’s nothing showing in the SD3 mixer. Use multiout and the regular hihat.
I’ve actually posted a couple of times that I have an xdrum hihat. 🙂 I am aware that it might have gotten lost as I write a lot. 🙂
My kit uses Death & Darkness -> death as the preset with some tweaks and xdrums. I grew up with Guitar Pro 3 and 4 and have used the GM instruments ever since…with 6 toms and two ride cymbals…one ride is panned to the left, one to the right.
I use two hihats (explained in one of my first posts) because a real drummer has to manually change open to closed or vice versa…and playing doublekick while playing a pattern with open AND closed hihats is not possible…but I like it… e.g. doublekick with blast parts and a closed hihat, but open accents here and there all while continuing the doublekick playing. Therefore, the regular hihat is used for many parts with open articulations, closed articulations, pedal work etc… like a real drummer would play. However, the second hihat is always closed…and is next to the first hihat in a virtual room. The always closed hihat is an xdrum and only used in blast parts…like in my example.
The xdrum hihat goes into the regular HH channel, just like the normal hihat.
The xdrum ride goes has the same effects in its channel, then goes into the OH bus just like the regular ride.
The xdrum tom used as the highest tom has the same effects etc. as the other toms…
All xdrums copy the settings of the regular kitpieces.
When playing back a midi file with the whole SD3 plugin sitting in one track with out 1&2 it sounds like the first example.
The second part of each of the two examples uses multiout…and normally, both should sound alike…but yet the second part (=multiout) in the first example sounds a bit different as if bleed etc. is missing…but the second example sounds ok…and normally, it should sound alike…but all settings are ok…so it might be a bug?
First part: SD3 in one track, out 1&2
Second part: multiout
First part: SD3 in one track, out 1&2
Second part: multiout
Should I upload my preset?
SeelenPuls ~ Poetic metal from Austria: SeelenPuls.at
Grummelgnom ~ Sociocritical metal from the forest: Grummelgnom.at
Here’s my preset… V2.7 is the one with no multiout…and V2.8 has multiout. You need Death of Death & Darkness and Metal Foundry (as far as I remember).
SeelenPuls ~ Poetic metal from Austria: SeelenPuls.at
Grummelgnom ~ Sociocritical metal from the forest: Grummelgnom.at
I’m done here – tried all I can do to help but you insist on doing things the hard way instead of just using multiout. You’re wasting time chasing something that no one has ever had a problem with in SD3. I repeat – if you want to send your session to a mixer person your best bet on capturing the essence of SD3 is to use multiout.
Jack
aka musicman691 on other forums
Superior Drummer 3.4.1
Area 33 1.0.0
Death and Darkness 1.0.1
PT 2021.6
OSX 10.13.6
3.46 GHz hex core 2012 MacPro 48 gig ram
I am already using multiout! 🙂 My problem is that the xdrum hihat does not sound the same like in the out 1&2 one channel setup with SD3 being in one channel.
I already made a template with multiout etc., but have a problem with the xdrum hihat and would like to know what causes this problem.
SeelenPuls ~ Poetic metal from Austria: SeelenPuls.at
Grummelgnom ~ Sociocritical metal from the forest: Grummelgnom.at
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