creativenorthmediaIts in the title.
I am guessing this is some kind of limitation with the VST format? Is there a way to import tempo changes from PT? Or do I have to manually go through and set tempos?
As an aside I am finding out about this WAY too late…
Bear-Faced CowThis is not a limitation since you are following the host tempo. You can export the MIDI from your DAW with tempo information and import it into your tempo map within SD3 and turn off Follow Host. Note, however that any type of gradual acceleration or deceleration within your DAW will not always translate properly into MIDI as your DAW would have to interpolate the values.
jord
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Thanked by: Shootie
roland ratYou need to import tempo to SD3. The tab for it is near to the export song as audio files one, in the same drop-down.
I have my song projects in Reaper, and there’s usually a lot of keyboard midi hanging around in there, so I can easily generate a project midi (.mid) file from the drop-down in Reaper. If there’s no midi in the project I can’t do it, but then as I’m a newb, I wouldn’y know. Not sure how PT would do it, but I would guess it is similar.
When you have the .mid file, (mine’s kept in audio D drive for ex) just open the import tempo tab in SD3 and click on the .mid file to load it in. Then, when you export your audio from SD3, make sure that follow host is OFF when you export, or it will come out totally wrong.
Rat.
creativenorthmediaIf it’s not a limitation then why doesn’t SDX export those tempo changes?
Thanks for the suggestion I will do that in future. SDX not following host native tempo changes when exporting is yet another piece of information not located in the fucking manual.
Bear-Faced CowIf it’s not a limitation then why doesn’t SDX export those tempo changes?
Because the tempo changes are in your DAW and not in SD3. SD3 (or any timeline based plug-in for that matter) only changes tempo when your DAW changes in real-time when “Follow Host” is enabled. It doesn’t know the tempo until told. That’s not a limitation.
jord
JohnSDX not following host native tempo changes when exporting is yet another piece of information not located in the fucking manual.
From the Manual, Chapter 7.1.1 Bounce:
If the MIDI sequence that you would like to Bounce is located in your host DAW, you will need to import it into the Song Track of Superior Drummer 3 using the Track menu’s “Import MIDI file” option. Importing a MIDI file will also import its tempo information which will result in the bounced audio files automatically conforming to tempo and any tempo changes that you may have set in your DAW. Once the file is imported de-select the Follow Host button in Superior Drummer 3’s transport as the tempo and tempo changes for the Bounce will now be derived from the imported file.
BR,
John
John Rammelt - Toontrack
Technical Advisor
creativenorthmediaI’m not sure why this is so difficult to understand. I get what you are saying, but if follow host is active during playback then it should also apply when exporting. This is not a stretch to imagine.
Also, I was asking if this isn’t possible due to some unforeseen limitation with the VST format and thereby placing that limitation on a technical level.
creativenorthmediaFair enough. It seems to be there when you hit the issue, not exactly helpful in showing the user how to avoid the issue in the first place. Also searching “tempo bounce” doesn’t return this info. Even “tempo” doesn’t show anything till waaaaaaayyyyy down at the bottom.
Something like this should be shown as a warning when bouncing, seems like a very critical oversight that could cost people time and money.
Mark KingWhy not put midi in the DAW and enable outputs in sd3 and render. If pro tools has that feature?
SD3 with older sdx,s plus Rooms of Hansa and Death & Darkness. Cubase and wavelab current versions. Roland TD50x using all trigger inputs for triggering SD3 only. Windows 11 computer. Various keyboards and outboard gear as well as VST instruments. Acoustic drums: Yamaha 9000 natural wood and Pearl masters. Various snare drums. RME BabyFace Pro FS and Adam A7X monitors
JohnHi,
there is always room for improvement, so I’ll forward your input to a colleague.
As to the ‘why’ ‘Follow Host’ doesn’t work for the SD3 internal Bounce is simply: ‘it does’ but not as you would want it to.
Since the DAW timeline isn’t running, there is no way for the plug-in to know there are Tempo changes.
When you have ‘Follow host’ Enabled, the plug-in listens to which Tempo is sent to it. When you perform the SD3 internal Bounce and have ‘Follow Host’ Enabled, the Tempo sent to the plug-in is the one at the current playhead position, i.e. if you have a Tempo set to 65bpm in the intro of your Song, 73bpm from 1st verse and 75bpm in the outro, the resulting Audio files being generated from SD3 will be at either of those tempi, depending on where your current playhead position is.
When you have imported the Tempo from a MIDI file, SD3 has a Tempo Track with the corresponding changes but since ‘Follow Host’ is Enabled, the plug-in will still listen to which Tempo is sent from the DAW. Disable Follow Tempo and the internal Tempo changes will be applied to the Bounced Audio files.
BR,
John
John Rammelt - Toontrack
Technical Advisor
creativenorthmediaThanks John, I’m sure there is a solution for this whether its having the VST control playback, or a checkbox to import the midi on export, or simply warning users about this issue when exporting and directing them to import the tempo changes manually.
Though if I’m honest, any manual solution should be discouraged. Not exactly what I would call professional tooling.
Bear-Faced CowYou are confusing professional with convenient. There is nothing unprofessional about importing the MIDI tempo map. This methodology has been known since its release back in 2017 and it’s perfectly valid. Not to mention that there is no reason why you can’t do anything that is manual. Professionalism is not about the tools, but the people using them.
The options you stated are not possible because plug-ins cannot control their hosts and cannot get any information from them beyond being provided the information in real time.
Mark’s solution is also a perfectly valid one that you can drag your MIDI into your DAW, and use it to control and render your output. That way any linear changes in tempo will be rendered accurately.
jord
creativenorthmedia“The options you stated are not possible because plug-ins cannot control their hosts and cannot get any information from them beyond being provided the information in real time.”
Sorry I don’t buy that, if you can import it manually using a button then you can add options to make this issue more obvious on export.
What’s more, if you can have a button that does it manually then you can have it import automatically. If you can’t listen for events in the VST framework then fine, but a loop that imports tempos every 10 seconds or so could be a solution. This might interfere with processing, so a button or checkbox on export is better.
The idea they “did it in 2017” is some kind of viable defense against progress is just silly. Just because they did it, doesn’t make it good.
Also “professional”, “convenient”, whatever dude that’s just semantics. No reason we can’t improve this clunky workflow and make it more idiot proof for everyone.
Bear-Faced CowWho cares whether you buy it or not. Plug-ins are not aware of their environment. They are sandboxed. Plain and simple. Plug-ins can only do do what they’re told to do. Exporting from the plug-in autonomous from the DAW and is not aware of any tempo changes within the DAW. It cannot ask the DAW for it beforehand.
So instead of bellyaching about it, you have two choices:
1. Import the tempo map from the DAW
2. Bounce from your DAW, where all tempo changes, including Bézier curves, will properly match. And if you do have tempo curves this is the best option.
jord
creativenorthmediaDude I’ve put forward a very sane and rational argument for improvements to this plugin, but all you seem concerned about is getting upset because someone dare suggest something outside what you deem is acceptable.
What I have suggested is not outside the realms of possibility. I’ll say it again: if I can manually import these tempos, then programming imports automatically or at least having an option on the export menu, should also be possible. I’m guessing you’re not a software engineer, that’s fine. I am and I’m telling you straight up, these solutions are possible.
Anyway you’ve jumped on a few of my threads now. I think this might be the 3rd time we have disagreed on something, which is fine in itself, but I find you particularly unpleasant. So I’m going to ask you this nicely: please do not engage with my threads in future, your engagement is not welcome. I’m happy to continue being a part of this community but if you continue to engage with me in any way I’ll just have to take it up with the mods.
Have a good one.
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