Better latency/buffer in standalone vs DAW (logic pro)

[tendingtropic]

Hi everyone!

I’m loving superior drummer, but have a question.

I’m using SD3 on a macbook pro (touchbar 15 inch 2016) with a RME babyface pro audio interface via a roland TD30 connected via midi.

when using the standalone SD3 I have buffer latency of 1.5ms at buffer size 64 and there are no problems or crackles. nice!

however, when using the SD3 plugin in logic, I hear crackles so I have to switch to 128 buffer size, then its fine, but the latency is a bit higher (3.8ms).

Do you have the same experience, that the performance of the SD3 standalone is better than the plugin/vst SD3?

curious to hear your experiences and tips/tricks!

Thanks,

Oscar

Superior Drummer 3 version: 3.1.5
Operating system: macOS High Sierra (10.13)

Topic

[mickg]

I have the same MacBook Pro but I have an Apollo thunderbolt interface (TB2-TB3 adapter).  My drive is a OWC Envoy Pro TB3 SSD. I’m running SD3 as a stand alone and my buffer is set to 64 (if there was a lower setting I believe it would work).
I have Pro Tools ultimate 2019.10. Tried using SD3 as a plug-in but could not get the latency lower than 128 without it crapping out. I gave up and I’m sticking with the stand alone.
I use this as a live drum rig. I have two drumkats and a trapkat as my live kit. Latency in standalone is great. Not so good as plug-in in any DAW.
Maybe with a new Mac Pro. I don’t have 6 grand to find out. Although the new mini looks pretty sweet.
Also, I have SD3 using only 1 core. I was having drop outs using more. Don’t know why, but switching fixed it.

Superior Drummer 3 version: 3.1.5
Operating system: macOS Mojave (10.14)

[tendingtropic]

Thanks for the quick reply!

interesting you have the same experience with the standalone performing better than the plugin in a DAW.

 

its a pity though, because I’d like to be able to record my drums within the DAW (as I can also listen to the rest of the project while recording).

You think its a CPU thing? are there ways to optimize the settings in SD3 and logic to make things optimal?

 

Thanks!

[Scott Eshleman]

Have either of you tried running the standalone & the plugin simultaneously,
monitoring only the standalone?

[tendingtropic]

Hi there scott, thanks for the reply,

interesting thought, what would the benefit be of running both simultaneously?

[Scott Eshleman]

tendingtropic wrote:

Hi there scott, thanks for the reply,

interesting thought, what would the benefit be of running both simultaneously?

You’ve both said that the standalone runs better than the plugin, with little-to-no latency.

If you play & monitor your performance through the standalone (with little-to-no latency)
you should be able to record your performance at the same time via the plugin in your DAW,
which is the goal, I assume. The recording should playback with no issues.

[tendingtropic]

Sounds great!

only worry: how to make it so that the recording in the daw starts exaxtly at the same time as the standalone version?

i know what i could do is bounce the project with a click track and play that as mp3 and record to that in the standalone and later import that in the daw. Its just such a hassle..

[Scott Eshleman]

tendingtropic wrote:

Sounds great!

only worry: how to make it so that the recording in the daw starts exaxtly at the same time as the standalone version?

i know what i could do is bounce the project with a click track and play that as mp3 and record to that in the standalone and later import that in the daw. Its just such a hassle..

Sorry for the confusion.

I am only suggesting that your performance is recorded in the plugin or DAW, not in the standalone. 
I’m suggesting that the standalone is only used for monitoring with little-to-no latency.

[Bear-Faced Cow]

This is being way too overthought as far as Logic goes. Latency within Logic is more pertinent to Audio rather than MIDI. there should be no perceived latency delay for MIDI input to software instruments, even at higher CoreAudio sample rates. If you are experiencing any noticeable delay within Logic, then you need to adjust your audio and/or delay compensation settings.

Just for reference, why are you go for settings are at 1024 and I am using SD3 through my Maschine control with no latency.

jord

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Jordan L. Chilcott

Web Site: https://jordanchilcottmusic.com/

[tendingtropic]

Thanks again for all the info. @Scott, I think I understand what you mean (i’d have to select the same kit in standalone and vst version, and then monitor on the standalone, to spare the recources/latency within the DAW.

However I also agree with Jord. Just to be clear Jord: you use buffer size of 1024??? whats your latency according to logic? must be >5ms?

Anyways,

its not really about the delay, cause 3,8ms is fine as latency, but its the crackles i hear at lower buffer sizes. This is probably a CPU thing?.

[Bear-Faced Cow]

Latency is definitely considerable at 1024. However, I’m not overly concerned since I use the audio monitoring of my UAD Apollo.

Crackling at 64 in Logic is more likely as the It has to work harder with a shorter buffer between its own audio processing and processing plug-Ins.

jord

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Jordan L. Chilcott

Web Site: https://jordanchilcottmusic.com/

[tendingtropic]

Tnx jord, what do you mean with using the audiomonitoring on the Apollo? couldn’t I do just something like that on my RME fireface? how?

[Bear-Faced Cow]

When I am recording audio, I am monitoring it through the Apollo, rather than using software monitoring within Logic. The Apollo provides near zero latency, with some other added benefits. this is what allows me to keep my core audio buffers at 1024. Less strain on the CPU.

jord

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Jordan L. Chilcott

Web Site: https://jordanchilcottmusic.com/

1

Thanked by: mickg

[mickg]

I see what you are saying. Latency in the DAW is not necessarily with the midi info coming in, but the audio going out, through whatever audio interface you are using (along with some internal routings of the DAW itself and the buffer setting needed). So, monitor the stand alone only while recording and monitor the recorded track through the DAWs audio interface. Because there should be no midi latency, there should be no timing issue when playing back all tracks through the DAW regardless of the buffer setting in the DAW. Smart.

Superior Drummer 3 version: 3.1.5
Operating system: macOS Mojave (10.14)

[Bear-Faced Cow]

I probably didn’t state myself clear enough. In Logic, latency will be apparently noticed when recording audio. When recording MIDI on an instrument track, Logic goes into live mode and latency won’t be apparent. It isn’t necessary to attempt to monitor through standalone.

jord

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Jordan L. Chilcott

Web Site: https://jordanchilcottmusic.com/

[Author]

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